Considering buying a foreclosed home owned by WF

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Permalink Reply by Eric C on June 4, 2011 at 11:15am

Just did a little digging on the previous owner, Donna Carpenter of Cape Corals, FL (address listed on the documents above).  Her Linkedin profile shows she's the VP of Residential Lending at Riverside Bank of the Gulf Coast.  Hmmm....

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Permalink Reply by wayoff on June 4, 2011 at 12:18pm

Good for you to do some homework.  With that said, "Stay away from foreclosed homes".  Sure you think you are getting a "good deal", but that deal of the century may end up being the nightmare of the century.  You are already questioning buying the home, that should say lots.  Go and look for a house that has nothing to do with foreclosure. 

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Permalink Reply by Eric C on June 4, 2011 at 12:29pm

Thanks wayoff - my gut reaction is usually not wrong - so I couldn't agree with you more. 

 

The only problem with finding a home "that has nothing to do with foreclosure" is, I think any home - current, delinquent, or foreclosed - which has had it's mortgage securitized (through MERS or otherwise), will likely suffer from the same clouded title deficiencies.

With all the media attention (not enough if you ask me) on the foreclosure fraud, it makes those properties the least attractive to insure for clean title.  But if you follow through the risk to not just illegally foreclosed-upon homeowners, but investors in multiple trusts who may have been sold the same mortgage... well, the nightmare scenario pretty much extends to ALL homes.

Never mind that the original promissory notes can't be found for any securitized debt.  The only difference between a foreclosed property and one that is not in default, is that with the foreclosure, it's a matter of record that no on knows who owns the debt.  The non-default homeowner has the same issue, but until he goes into default, tries to refinance, pays off the mortgage, or tries to sell, he just doesn't know yet.

And therein lies my dilemma.  If every home has a clouded title, what will it matter in the long run?

I certainly have not made up my mind.  The temptation of a 'deal too good to pass up' has bitten me before with other things.  I'm just trying to see all sides.

 

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Permalink Reply by wayoff on June 4, 2011 at 6:42pm

I am no expert in MERS and I don't claim to be.  In my opinion MERS has destroyed the land title records whether it involves a foreclosure or not.  Here is what I believe the difference to be.  Even if MERS is determined to be illegal in all transactions, I feel that a house that has been sold and resold, if not in foreclosure, the paperwork to correct the transactions can be resolved within time.  There are no former homeowners claiming fraud.   However; in the case of foreclosures, the whole forecloure is illegal because the banks and the low lifes they hire are bringing in documents that involve fraud.  Once fraud is involved everything changes. Whether or not the homeowner made payments becomes irrelevant.  Fraud is illegal, period.  The banks knew there could be a problem with MERS from the start and while they got away with it it was all fine.

 

I think it matters greatly because in non foreclosures the former homeowner that sold the house probably would want no claim to it.  In foreclosures, the homeowners are fighting the fraud and corruption involved in the process.  And if the day comes when the powers that be get their heads out of their you know whats, the house may be returned to the forelcosed on homeowner.  Will that happen, I doubt it, but there is always hope true justice will prevail.  You seem like a very kind person.  Would you actually feel good about buying a house where an elderly person, a sick person, a disabled  person, or a family with small children were thrown out of because of fraud all because the deal is too good to pass up?  And no one knows if the correct party foreclosed on the home.  Bad karma.  All of this was started because the banks wanted to make millions off the misery of others.  The desicion is yours and you will make your choice as you see fit.  I still say stay away from foreclosed homes.  Buying a house that was not in foreclosure, in my opinion, would be a safer and wiser choice.  Good luck. 

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Permalink Reply by saving my home in floridah on June 5, 2011 at 11:00pm

YES GOOD FOR YOU STAY AWAY BUT PLEASE CONTACT THE OWNERS  contact the old owners tell them about this web site and how they can appeal and get their home back.  when the and all of us applied for motgages dueing this securitization fiasco  the lender whom is on our mortgages is not he lender.  the lender/investor  was not named  when we signed,    because they were not listed is fraud there is case law proving this.  they need to appeal and get there house back.  you have to look for a home that is an estate sale  where the loan was older no securitization involved.  we are in trouble and all in the fight of our lives.  the appraisal were all fraud.

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Permalink Reply by Eric C on June 6, 2011 at 12:04am

Well, for what it's worth, wife and I visited the property today (without a realtor) and found out why the home has been listed for so long, with price dropping every couple of weeks.   The front corner of the home has a huge stair-step crack, at least 1" wide.  No doubt, a sinkhole is opening up.   Further, the front door frame has so much termite damage, there is little visible paint left. 

 

The neighbor said one of the windows was broken, and not repaired for months.  Power has been off for at least two years.   Still, $300k for 20 acres of land, even if the home is completely demolished, is not a bad price. 

 

But, given the uncertainty of the paperwork, the sinkhole, and about 1/3 of the property being within the SWFTMD flood plain, we've scratched this one off our list.

 

@SMHF - The original owners were clearly investors trying to flip the property.  I've looked at their public record history, and they've bought/sold many homes per year leading up to this one - all the while living in their Cape Coral home since the late 90's.   Not that I think it makes bank fraud any more acceptable (it doesn't), but if people are buying/selling homes like stocks, I have little sympathy when they get burned.  Especially since this type of 'speculating' and flipping was a large part of the cause of the run up in home prices.

 

Remember how at the peak of the home buying/investing hysteria, builders were making buyers sign contracts forbidding them to sell the property within X years of closing?  That happened to us when we bought in 2003 - before the peak.   Builders were putting brand new homes on the market for $150k, and investors bought up everything before the first foundation was poured.  Then, once construction was complete, they'd flip at closing for 50% increase.  So, no sympathy here.

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Permalink Reply by saving my home in floridah on June 6, 2011 at 8:10am

hey eric yes!!! i am south florida and lived in a small house in holly wood and bought a preconstruction home fron gl homes. i am no investor all i wanted was my kids to grown up in a nice home home, and good schools (hollywod beach is beautiful hence my picture but infastructure poor). we were lied to and scammed taxes more the n doubled. there were investors in everyiother house. we had to sign that we were not investors we were going to live on the property. so the lies started there. my husband lost his job and we moved. when we were tol to default by wells fargo to get help on our present mortgage that is when my research began and i also uncovered the flipped house and the straw buyer on my appriasal. see no doing what they did is not illegal. what is not so for the appraiser is to use homes that havr EXTREMELY scewed high values. these homes are usually dropped from a comp' what i learned about appraisals if there are no comps in oyur immediate area they can go further away and just add or subtract land value, bedrooms ect. my appraiser did not do that he use properties surrounding my home and they were used soley to get my property vslue above asking price. then the next line of defense is the loan uinderwriter. if they check an appraisal that has unually high property value comps. it is suppose to be trown out.
but as the story goes about this ponzi scheme wells fargo did not loan me the money the house was paid for at closing and no one cared about the appaisal.

good fro you doing your homework!!!! imagine if you did not and bought the house like so many other people have done.

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Permalink Reply by 2 Pirates over 40 on June 6, 2011 at 12:18pm

Eric C, no sense in trying to contact the previous owners, as in my opinion they were a HUGE part of why we are in this situation with real estate today. Your best  means to satisfy your curiousity would to contact the county property appraisers website to see what the property is appraised at, then you can almost be guaranteed that the same property is  going to go down in value a couple more times in the near future. What seems like a good deal today, might not be such a good deal tomarrow or even next yr, or years to come. Plus, the title insurance, can you even get title insurance ? That question can only be answered when you try to get the insurance. Good luck,           myself, I'd steer clear of it.

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Permalink Reply by Eric C on June 6, 2011 at 12:19pm

2PO40 - No doubt.  I've scratched it off my list.  County's appraised value is about the current asking price - with 2/3 of the appraisal coming from the value of the land.

 

Too much of a headache.

 

Thanks all for the words of wisdom.

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Permalink Reply by wayoff on June 6, 2011 at 12:55pm

Eric, in my opinion you made the rght choice.  You did a good job in doing your homework and I think all others who have read your post should take a lesson from you.  When buying a house now days, it is imperative you do research on the home you are buying whether the house was a foreclosure or not.  There are all those hidden secrets one finds out after a couple of years.  In all honesty, you cannot trust a realtor to give you all the facts.

 

Those of us who have lost our homes to illegal foreclosure are aware of the problems that this mess has caused.  We care about everyone who is buying a home and here to warn people that the too good to pass up deal may not be that good after all.  Good luck to you in your house hunting.  And continue to do you research.  My added personal moto "Stay away from foreclosed homes".  Saving and 2 Pirates comments are right on the mark. 

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Permalink Reply by saving my home in floridah on June 7, 2011 at 12:39am

funny you say that i live in florida

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Permalink Reply by Diane on June 7, 2011 at 10:34am

Alright, I lost my home to GMAC Mortgage, INC now known as Ally Financial two years ago.   They intimidated me, threatened me and made my life so miserable my family and I were uprooted and left.   We had no clue about mortgage foreclosure fraud at that time, and believed these miserable monsters were going to have the sheriff throw us out on the street.

 

Just two weeks ago I went to the County Clerk's office to get a copy of the file used in the foreclosure and GMAC fraudulently represented themselves as the note holder in due course, and produced an old Bank of America paid in full note in the amount of $60,000. they found somewhere, when they were foreclosing on a $417,000. mortgage.    The Clerk of Courts rubber stamped it, and house was auctioned off.     Now that I'm on top of things, I sent a RESPA letter to them three weeks ago, and received an unsigned response stating all they must give me is a copy of the note and payment history.    Oddly enough, even though the loan was securitized in 2007, they produced a note altered showing pay to the order of (whited out) so it just shows a person's name.   Oh I forgot to add my foreclosure affidavit was excuted by the now infamous Jeffrey Stephan.   Once auctioned at sheriff's sale, GMAC immediately sold it to Fannie Mae and Fannie Mae sold the house to another individual, who has it now listed himself.

 

My question is how do I get a cloud on the title.    Do I try to take a lien on the house?    Or do I contact the current homeowner and tell he or she what happened?     Do I make a claim with a title insurance company.      I am in North Carolina, which sadly reigns as one of the Bankster capitals of the world (Bank of America) ....   so not expecting any help from the state attorney general.

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